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» TMO Talk » The Dead » The Evolution of Language. (Page 6)

 
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Author Topic: The Evolution of Language.
Raz
Karma Police
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Alright Mart?

How much vodka have you drunk? I have drunk this much: lots.


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mart
Wearing nothing but a smile
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Raz. I've been drinking martinis, so mucho gin. I have one cigarette left. One fag, if you will. When I only have one smoke left, I rest it on the keys above the number pad on my keyboard. I'm quite looking forward to going out and buying some more (tomorrow's a bank holiday, see, so no worries about bedtime), but I'm having a mighty fine MSN chateo with someone who tolerates me marvellously when I'm drunk, and I fear that to wander off for 15 mins to buy fags will result in her going to bed.......... oh que faire, que faire....
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Raz
Karma Police
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You are a big pissed ginger witch. Spain is rubbish, aprt from Belita.

I am listening to Tatu covering The Smiths, and getting abuse for doing so.

One fag is poetry. Do you ever think about one fag, then suicide?

Hey; is it true that you still get black tobacco in Spain?


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mart
Wearing nothing but a smile
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Yeah man! Black tobacco is rock. Strictly heterosexual.


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mart
Wearing nothing but a smile
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A half English, half Spanish friend of mine has a theory about women who smoke. He says: "She smokes black tobacco? Comes from a pueblo" (i.e. a village, not the city). As a generalisation, it kinda works, too.
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Raz
Karma Police
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Woman + black tobacco = filthy fucking whore.

Yeah, I can dig that.

Über and her new boyfriend are having a big argument about music as I type. Let's hope they sort it out, huh?

I am wanting to be into Spain right now, but unfortunately I am listening to Placebo/Rammstein, so my allegiance is mismatched to my self-imposed cultural psyche.

Pisslicks! This has ascended into chate, and I love this thread and would hate to kill it! Hey, non-ex-pats/prostitutes: cary on talking about language when you read this, si?


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mart
Wearing nothing but a smile
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Raz yor rite. Doo yoo "doo" MSN? ginger@intercom.es
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mart
Wearing nothing but a smile
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He does! And so the thread was saved.
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Stefanos
Biggus Dickus
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quote:
Originally posted by mart:
And I think it came to us through Latin, not through the actual presence of Romans in Britain, so the "five words" thing that I read about may still stand. So, er, there.

Yup - as I said earlier, most English words with Latin roots come via the Normans.

By the 6th Century, `Vulgar Latin' was spoken in R**e and was already diverging in places like Hispania and Gaul; at some point in the 8th Century (I think) early French first appeared. The Normans, who had settled in NW France were basically Vikings and assimilated pretty quickly within a century; the Channel Islands version of French is the direct descendent of their language.

I am told that the closest modern language to classical Latin is Portuguese in terms of pronunciation.

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Essex boy in exile.


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Octavia
I hate Valentine's Day.
Stupid commercialised crap
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Dazzlerman, please could this threde be archived?
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Harlequin
Sponsored by Rohypnol®
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By the way all our modern swear words didn't start off as swear words their meaning gradually changed over the centuries until their meaning meant something offensive! Many old swear word that were common centuries ago have fallen out of use. One such word is oddsbodkins a very offensive word in its day.
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Dr. Benway

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how come you know so much about swearing, Harly?

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I have shit on you, son

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d666
I'd like to conform with the masses
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cos like you know, its fighting against the man. man.

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i was there. i was there.
i've never been wrong.

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kovacs

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quote:
Originally posted by Harlequin:
By the way all our modern swear words didn't start off as swear words their meaning gradually changed over the centuries until their meaning meant something offensive

Shakespeare uses "prick" with its modern meaning.

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member #28


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Bandy
Watchoo talkin' 'bout

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In the late 19th century, the term "Barn Shaw" was commonly used and extremely derogitory. It came back with the soldiers who had fought in India and was a bastardisation of the Gujurati term "Ben Shaud" (Sister Fucker).

Its a shame that this quickly fell out of popular use as I think its really rather quaint.

There are a couple of pages in Down and Our in Paris and London where Orwell examines swear word usage at the beginning of the 20th Century vis-a-vis the words 'bloody' and 'fuck'. Its interesting how modern swearing compares to his predictions.

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Shameless Promotion: huddle - online project and document collaboration


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vikram

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Modge - You're learning Gaelic? How come? Also I would be v interested to hear your views on Melanie Phillips who as you can imagine I really don't like.
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dang65
it's all the rage
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quote:
Originally posted by kovacs:
l'esprit d'escalier

It only occurred to me last night what l'esprit d'escalier must actually refer to. As you're walking away from a conversation, going up to bed or out of the office on the way home for example, the Spirit of the Stairs possesses you and tells you what you should've said in your conversation. I suppose everyone else knew that all along, but I'm a bit slow me.


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Bamba

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quote:
Originally posted by Octavia:
Dazzlerman, please could this threde be archived?

Phew! Just as well I edited out my gushingly embarrasing and stupid reply to Modge then. Which I notice you've all been gracious enough not to mention. Thanks for that as I was mortified when I stumbled across it this morning.


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Octavia
I hate Valentine's Day.
Stupid commercialised crap
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Lol. We all read it though. And we all remember it. And may or may not bring it in as evidence.
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Bamba

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On the topic of swearing I find it interesting that ****, which I believe was initially a genuine and valid word for the female genitals like vagina is currently*, is now considered the most offensive swear word and is especially hated by women themselves.

*I'm willing to be wrong about this, I think I read it somewhere once.


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Bamba

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quote:
Originally posted by Octavia:
Lol. We all read it though. And we all remember it. And may or may not bring it in as evidence.

I doubt you're all short on evidence of my general fuckwittedness. Last night's effort simply added to the already creaking and swaying tower of proof that I'm a fucking idiot who shouldn't be allowed to do anything when drunk, much less post on here. The fact that no one mentioned it actually terrified me as I thought this meant I'd crossed a line into saying something so bad that you were all afraid to even take the piss out of me for it. Fuck it though, who cares really.


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Thorn Davis

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quote:
Originally posted by Bamba:
I thought this meant I'd crossed a line into saying something so bad that you were all afraid to even take the piss out of me for it. Fuck it though, who cares really.

Kovacs does. He was really angry about it.

I think it'd be a shame if Bambi stopped posting when drunk. I think it's great.


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dang65
it's all the rage
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I'd like to post when sober one day, but I need that extra courage unfortunately.
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Bamba

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quote:
Originally posted by Thorn Davis:
Bambi.


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d666
I'd like to conform with the masses
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i love your drunken master wu-tang-sword style postings, if you were to stop i'd have to consider going on "I'm using uppercase and not ranting at the screen until Bamba posts drunk again" strike or something.

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i was there. i was there.
i've never been wrong.

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Bamba

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quote:
Originally posted by d666:
i love your drunken master wu-tang-sword style postings, if you were to stop i'd have to consider going on "I'm using uppercase and not ranting at the screen until Bamba posts drunk again" strike or something.

But then DD would have to carry "Lower Case Posterz" flag all on her lonesome. Burdened with the stress, the public ridicule and the social ostracism yet bravely struggling on without anyone to share her misery. Could you do that to her Damo? Could you really?


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mart
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Ah, swearing. C.unt was certainly once relatively harmless, with Chaucer dropping it “casually and severally” into The Canterbury Tales, spelling it queynte, queinte and even Kent. Prick may have been used by Shakespeare, but it seems not to have been “rude” until the eighteenth century. A much more interesting swearer than Shakespeare is Ben Johnson, who came up with choice phrases ‘Whoreson base fellow’, whoreson coney-catching rascal’, ‘by my fackins faith’ and (my favourite) ‘I am the rankest cow that ever pissed’.

Apparently the Japanese, Malayans, most Polynesians and American Indians have no native swear words. And the Finns, it would seem, shout ‘in the restaurant’ when they do something like hit their thumb with a hammer. Mental.


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Bamba

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quote:
Originally posted by mart:
And the Finns, it would seem, shout ‘in the restaurant’ when they do something like hit their thumb with a hammer. Mental.

This page paints a much less polite and restrained picture of the Finnish language. Containing such gems as how to say "smell cock" and "rip your ass open". There's also a version of "fuck you" which translates as "ski into a ****" although "a whining weed fucked by the wind" is a rather bizarre phrase. I think I'd be more confused than insulted by it.

Edit:sorted.

[ 01 May 2003: Message edited by: Bamba ]


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d666
I'd like to conform with the masses
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quote:
Originally posted by Bamba:
Could you do that to her Damo? Could you really?

no.
bastard.
you've got me with the moral backbone thing again.

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i was there. i was there.
i've never been wrong.


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discodamage
Again with the bagels ?
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quote:
Originally posted by d666:
no.
bastard.
you've got me with the moral backbone thing again.


coming from someone who just last week compared me to ben elton and joe pasquale in the space of 5 minutes i find this newfound moral fiber hard to give credence to.

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EXETER- movement of Jah people.


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discodamage
Again with the bagels ?
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coneycatcher is one of my fave insults. coney at the time meant rabbit, whilst the word rabbit was only used for very small rabbits. coneycatcher itself means vagabond. this is the second time i have read the word 'coneycatcher' today- the first was in the essay from which i took my new tag. a special present to anyone who knows/can guess what or whom the essay was about.

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EXETER- movement of Jah people.

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kovacs

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quote:
Originally posted by mart:
Ah, swearing. C.unt was certainly once relatively harmless, with Chaucer dropping it “casually and severally” into The Canterbury Tales, spelling it queynte, queinte and even Kent.


Well, I disagree a little here, and by extension with Harley's notion that our swearwords weren't offensive in their use centuries ago.

I don't know the Chaucer examples you refer to here -- I was trying to think of one in The Wife of Bath, which I think is quoniam or something -- but you can't argue that he was using the words neutrally. Surely they were meant to raise a dirty laugh; which is different from using them as a deeply offensive insult, but it still implies they had a taboo power.

quote:

Prick may have been used by Shakespeare, but it seems not to have been “rude” until the eighteenth century.

Again I disagree. In Romeo and Juliet the word is used as what the commentaries in my skoolbooks used to call "a bawdy quibble" -- the line is something like "the bawdy hand of time stands at the prick of noon" -- and it occurs in the context of Mercutio making fun of and semi-flirting with the Nurse. It might not be the same as "you prick", but you can't say it's not being used for "rudeness" value.

See also Henry V -- Henry's French queen to be (too hungover to get book down from nearby shelf, but still I think I am doing quite well considering -- see my post yesterday in "patois" for how drunk I was by 5pm) is practicing English, and getting it all wrong, viz. "les fingres, le nick", and finally "le count", which is clearly meant to be a joke on "the c*nt" and which surprised me when I saw it intact in the Laurence Olivier version.

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member #28


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Thorn Davis

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See also Hamlet sticking his face into Ophelia's lap and referring to "c*nt"ry matters. That's played for a rude laff too, and it shows he's going mad because he's in court and shamlessly talking about putting his face in his girlfriend's c**t, which is the sort of thing you'd only do if you were a madman.
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kovacs

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Thorn is right.

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member #28

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Frank
moon-chain-silver-mother-breakfast-fry-up-sausage
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Very good, Thorn. You win me.

Cnut

[ 01 May 2003: Message edited by: Frank ]

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Or not sure. Or not important


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